WIP Beta released The Tennessee USA Roane County 0.71 Beta Discussion/Suggestion/feedback Thread 19.3.1

Ahem, this is unreadable at all mate. I rewrote the text for ya.
"Для комфортной игры на данной карте, ваша система должна соответствовать следующим системным требованиям:
-8 Гб оперативной памяти минимум (рекомендуется 12-16 ГБ для стабильного использования нескольких ИИ(ботов), рекомендуется использовать подкачку).
-64-битная система, выше XP.
-2Гб видеопамяти для игры на средних настройках Или 3Гб для игры на высоких."

 

4096x4096 expanded to 21299x21299, 'background mountains' past the edge of the 'terrain' not included.
Roughly 12.x miles by 12.x miles, or 21.3km x 21.3km.

Okay, I will take your word for it! Will post it to the description. It's google translated - so don't hang me for it - Thanks.

 

Cant reply on the review page.

Why i gave this map 3 stars:
Fps issues mainly.

I can have maxed out everything on most maps with 40-60 fps stable. But big maps have a tendency to cause fps issues, yours specially. Was gonna give 2 but the map was just too good.

 

Excuse my sarcasm, but gee, I wonder why the 144 sq mile map is hard to run with good fps?
Could it possibly be that it's massive and you need a good computer to run it?
My laptop can't even load this map, but that's not the maps fault, that's due my laptop being old and pretty weak. Don't give a bad review for a massive map being hard on fps, you should expect that going in due to the nature of how big this map is.

 

My computer can run this fine, and it's older than your setup. Perhaps it's a Ryzen issue?

 

Radeon R9 380 will give LOW fps with max settings, because you're filling up the 4gb frame-buffer (or close to it, usually 3.x GB), and asking it to process A LOT of polys here. A LOT of polys. For MILES. There's NOTHING I can do to make it run better buddy, not beyond 10% better, that I haven't already done. You're rating my map low because it's packed with detail and you're running a video board several years old. That being said you should have enough VRAM for high, but do watch w/MSI afterburner or similar.
TURN DOWN your settings. NO REFLECTIONS with that card & this map. It will give a big boost - like 25~50% speed boost - or more. Surely the card can run the tiny map just fine. So can my old 7850 2gb from 2013! But big map needs bigger better hardware.
I am not a 100~300 person dev-team. I am one single person, with a few folks donating assets. This is free, and not 59.99$ price.
It's all perspective.

No it's not a Ryzen issue, buddy. It's a BK&C error with too high settings for mega-monstrous map
Ryzen, for the records, is generally (with 2933mhz dual channel memory mind you) faster than a similarly-clocked i7 6900k with ddr4 quad channel 2400mhz by 10% in Beamng.drive computations for physics.

His CPU is fine. His GPU is getting older and showing it's age. I have an RX 480 and it gets 30fps in some spots in my own map, high detail, low reflections at minimum. One spot in Harriman actually dropped it to 24FPS. I was SHOCKED, that just became an issue recently. I will have to turn down a setting before driving back to Harriman.
I can run 60~100+ FPS on ECA. Same settings I get 30~80fps here. Why? The view range, and the detail.

---

"TLDR"
This is not a map of cordoned-off areas, that really can't see one another due to high hills and tree-lines you can't drive through.
This is real terrain, so yes, it WILL be SLOW. The trade-off is you're really driving in a real place in america, and there's few if any walls you can't drive past. This is a simulation, this isn't a made-for-gaming map where you have a linear path and that's all you have. It's not once and done either. There's always a place you haven't driven.

Again, yes I am blunt - attempting to be rude - NO - but blunt, yes. Straight to the point, though might need a thousand words to get there.

Just turn off your reflections while driving this map. Sorry but for now this is the way it has to be until we all have better hardware.
Pre-release game, pre-release map that's the biggest earthen map ever made for said pre-release game.
What could go wrong?

 

Map loads but then Windows closes BeamNG for using more RAM than I have, even though Task Manager says I'm only using 10 GB out of my installed 16 GB. GPU shows only 3.5 GB VRAM out of 8 GB, so idk why I can't play this map.

 

My recommendations -
Lower Texture Quality to Medium/Low
Lower Shader/Lighting Quality to Medium
Turn off Dynamic Reflections
Turn on "Disable Shadows - Partial/All"

Are you using an integrated GPU? It is pretty unusual for a GPU to have 8 GB of ram. If you are, it means that half of your 16 Gb in memory is being preallocated as GPU memory, leaving you 8 Gb of ram and thus, not enough to load and run the map.

In the event that you are using an integrated GPU, I would recommend lowering the memory dedicated to it to 2-4 Gb (and no more) in Bios (if your desktop supports this) to maximize the amount of free ram available for level loading.

Even then, I am not entirely sure it will run. Integrated GPU's are famously not very great, as they rely on taking up your RAM to provide memory to support the GPU's processes.

It'd be beneficial if you could post your system specifications to the best of your ability, as while 16 Gb of RAM is helpful, it may not be enough when you factor in the rest of your PC's components.

 

Lower settings made no difference, game closed at 10 GB RAM usage

PC Specs:
Intel Core i5-4670k @ 3.4 GHz (Turbo to 3.8 GHz)
Asus M32 AD OEM motherboard
Kingston HyperX 16 GB DDR3 RAM
600 GB 5400 rpm HDD (Game install location)
ROG Strix GTX 1070 w/ 8 GB GDDR5 VRAM
Windows 10 Home (x64)

 

Never heard of Windows closing the game. Glad I never updated to Windows 10 though. 7 ftw. They couldn't pay me to take it. I will switch over to 7 pro before I go to 10. Heard of endless problems with it... everyone I know, problems after problems, and nothing but.
Unless you're my retired mother who uses it for email and nothing else. Sure boots fast though on the athlon II machine I built her 10 years ago with a SSD slapped into it (4 seconds). That's about all I have good to say about Windows 10.
Consider installing Windows 7 or 8.1 and/or making sure your pagefile is active in Windows 10. Virtual memory, also called a pagefile, is REQUIRED as per the mod description, please make sure it's enabled. You can google how to check that if not sure.
Also, maybe there's a nanny setting you could shut off to keep Microshaft Winblows from preventing you from using your 'puter.
This can use up to 16~24gb of pagefile/virtual memory. I haven't experienced it using over 22gb of it though, mine's fixed at 32gb.
Let me know how it works out.

I won't be switching to Windows 10 for years yet. When I build a new computer (which will be when they don't support Windows 7 anymore) I will likely have to use Linux (Suse/Debian distros or Slackware) vs Windows 10.

Not looking forward to 'dependency hell' again though...ugh, 10~12 years ago they started excluding GCC from some of the distros, @#$%!

Again, keep me posted. Check system logs in event viewer to see why Windows closed the game if you can't fix it.

 

@eastman12

This thread appears to contain a solution that may be worth trying. Hope it can solve your issue, as I am on Windows 10 Home with 16 Gb of ram and have never experienced the error you are describing.

Edit - May not work unless the posted "install" solution at the bottom of the thread (links out to DeviantArt for download, scan with virus scanner and use at own risk) works for you, as you are on Windows 10 Home and not Professional. If it doesn't, try googling around - I found that thread by literally searching "windows 10 shutting down programs for using too much ram"

 

Wow, boy am I glad I never put 10 on my PC. NEVER EVER EVER EVER (not until I have NO choice, like new processor / mobo or something). I would never be able to work on Roane County TN, I always use 85% + of my 16gb in hours-long editing sessions (yes, editing uses more).
As someone on that very page put it "Windows Sucks".

This comes from someone who *LOVED* Windows 2000, and who *LOVED* XPLITE for being able to strip so many components out of XP it *FLEW* on a core2duo on a 10k RPM HDD. It was awesome. Then I had to switch to 7, and I just about cried.
WHY MUST THEY FORCE CHANGE. I DO NOT LIKE CHANGE. I LIKE IT SET AND FUNCTIONING THE WAY IT ALWAYS DID.
If it's not broke, don't fix it. Windows 7 works, so I won't be upgrading. I have enough pain so as it is.
The more they cultivate Windows for the masses, the WORSE it gets for us techie guys.
(this post wasn't meant to be rubbing salt in someone's wounds, but know that I DO share your pain)...

Find the registry entry for Windows 10 low ram warning if you can.

 

Heh, personally I've worked with Windows XP whole my life because of the sounds it had, the colours, themes, I loved it (and the games!!). The other reason why was we (my parents and I, obv) weren't interested in buying a new computer with Win 7, for example because we were happy with our pc's/laptops. Untill we bought a laptop a few years ago which had Win 8/8.1 which SUCKED. So slow, annoying and ugly as heck. When Win 10 came out my parents were really happy with it because of it being way, way faster than 8. Personally, my favourites are then obviously XP and 10. Sorry not sorry, but I really enjoy the simplicity of Win 10. As of now I'm using the professional version of 10, or whatever it's called, I'm loving it to be honest.
I've never had problems with ram usage or anything.

Windows XP and 10 ftw for me.

 

Hello, why does the car shake so much? also, why does the UI restart like every 10 seconds?
PC specs:
CPU: i5 4690k at 4 GHz
GPU: GTX 980 (MSI) with 4gb GDDR5 VRAM
Mother-board: MSI Z97 PC Mate
RAM: DDR3 8gb at 800 MHz
ROM: 1T HDD and about 120 gb SSD (The game is on the SSD)
Windows 10 Pro

 

I think you misunderstand me. I am a techie myself, and know exactly how much pagefile I have and how much of it is on each drive in my PC (I have a 6 GB file, 1 GB on my game drive, 5 GB on my overflow drive). If its using nearly 20 GB of pagefile though, thats kinda crazy and I don't really think you should have that much set, as it could cause unnecessary strain on a drive. This also has nothing to do with Windows 10, as this is the only map, and the only game, in which this error comes up (excluding Forza 7 when it had extreme memory leaking problems). Plus, I'd like to also note that Windows itself isn't closing BeamNG, BeamNG is closing itself. The error pop-up is not a Windows one (as I've seen with Forza, and Space Engineers when I only had 8 GB of RAM). In other games, I can use 14-15.6 GB of RAM with Windows complaining about nothing. BeamNG doesn't like the amount of RAM its using.


The endless myriad of problems you reference were in the early days of 10, and have mostly* been fixed now. In addition to that, I never experienced problems myself since I'm an experienced techie. In fact, I bypass the whole "modern" start menu thing and use the classic Windows 7 menu instead. In other news, I'll never consider installing another legacy version of Windows (unless its XP because pretty sounds) because 10 has many improvements over previous versions, most notably stability, features, and performance.

I'd also like to mention that the mod post DOES NOT say it requires a pagefile. Instead it says its STRONGLY RECOMMENDED. And it also states that you need a minimum of 6 GB free RAM and a GPU that has 4+ GB of VRAM for max detail. Idling with 3 Chrome tabs open, Spotify, Discord, wallpaper engine, and steam running uses 5.4 GB RAM. I have 16 GB installed with 8 GB of VRAM, so it should work, no? With the game running (no maps open) the RAM usage only increases to about 6 GB. And through further testing, loading the default spawn location does let me load the map. But, after driving around a short time, the game closes itself again.

*Windows Store still sucks at downloading things, but there is a solid work-around for power users

 

Ok, awesome you're a techie, this is a good thing. I have to share that I cannot take for granted that folks know anything about the box they sit in-front of by default. So now with the unpleasentries (sic?) out of the way...
Increase the pagefile size and see if that works. Yes it uses a lot for the large-scale map size. It's due to the forest brush and the sheer amount of physics computations it must be able to reference properly. All the trees, homes, etc, all need space in the forest brush for their physics models / collision, basically. If the pagefile causes undue strain, well, as long as you don't have a Seagate HDD (a non-enterprise one anyways) you should be fine.
I've used pagefile on drive c: and d: over the years, on an all SSD machine, while it's mostly used the one on drive c: for 80~90% of the time, the drives are still at 86~87% life expectancy over 3 years time (October 2014 install date). Lots of content creation, years of Beamng and a year and a half of this map (in February it will mark two years since I started this map).
The drives are 2d MLC nand for what it's worth, a pair of 256gb drives striped without parity. My backup array is striped with parity, also 2d MLC. This also has very little wear but that's because it's newer.
So again my apologies if I have to assume everyone has little knowledge of the PC as this is the tech support and feedback thread.
For what it's worth, the maximum pagefile size on this computer (since last reboot a week or two ago) has been 33,364mb, according to Afterburner program. If beamng is crashing with a 0xFFFFFFFF that is possibly why - and that's with 16gb of RAM installed here, and not included in that total, mind you.
Does Pagefile wear the SSD? A little bit, but not a life-changing amount. So as it is, unless you're running nefarious things like bit-torrents or defragging it daily (which you shouldn't do either), the drive use won't lead to excessive wear.
Also remember, as in torture tests, many SSD's out-lasted the manufacturers specification by at-least 2x, and some, including a Samsung drive, lasted several times further before finally giving up the ghost with non-correctable reads.
--- Post updated ---

It shakes due to floating point precision, or the lack there-of. Floating point is a non-precise, rounded type of math, that the processor's aptly named Floating-Point-Unit can process quickly. It's called an FPU for short. This 'rounding' has a side-effect, and that's that the car shakes as if a vacuum hose or two has popped off a 4 cylinder engine. This is purely visual and does not negatively affect the physics in any way or sort, and more or less is merely a side-effect in, the further you get from 0,0,0, the more you see this rounding as the number is higher and floating point only does say 8 digits* or something like that and then rounds it (*subject to correction).

Please turn off your mini-map as it does not work well with this Roane County map. I have filed a bug report about just that. It's best to turn off the mini-map before starting this map but it shouldn't prove fatal if you don't. This map is huge, it's monstrous, and it's chock-full of objects, using 82% of the game's limit of objects (enough to get everything done, though). All things considered, if there's a weak-point anywhere, this map will surely find it. This map, for what it's worth, was originally the 'large-scale map test/ open world map test' for Beamng.

 

In regards to my comment about pagefiles wearing down drives, SSDs aren't affected as much due to the nature of their storage. I was mainly referencing mechanical HDDs since they have moving mechanical parts that tend to wear out after a while. I'll try a pagefile size increase and see if it lets me run the map, if it does, I may need to do a storage upgrade sooner than I had anticipated. Right now I only have 3 drives, the 1 TB C:, my 500 GB D:, and a 250 GB overflow drive. But the problem with upgrading is I don't have enough SATA ports, so either a new mobo or a PCI card. But the problem with an expansion card is it will block my GPU's cooler...

 

It shakes due to floating point precision, or the lack there-of. Floating point is a non-precise, rounded type of math, that the processor's aptly named Floating-Point-Unit can process quickly. It's called an FPU for short. This 'rounding' has a side-effect, and that's that the car shakes as if a vacuum hose or two has popped off a 4 cylinder engine. This is purely visual and does not negatively affect the physics in any way or sort, and more or less is merely a side-effect in, the further you get from 0,0,0, the more you see this rounding as the number is higher and floating point only does say 8 digits* or something like that and then rounds it (*subject to correction).

Please turn off your mini-map as it does not work well with this Roane County map. I have filed a bug report about just that. It's best to turn off the mini-map before starting this map but it shouldn't prove fatal if you don't. This map is huge, it's monstrous, and it's chock-full of objects, using 82% of the game's limit of objects (enough to get everything done, though). All things considered, if there's a weak-point anywhere, this map will surely find it. This map, for what it's worth, was o

You can get one of those highpoint/marvell controller cards that fits in a PCI-E x1 slot, doesn't take up too much room. Use a PCI-E Riser to move it to a different slot in the case, away from the card. A riser just plugs into (with a tiny ribbon cable) the pci-e x1 port and gives you either an x1 or x16 slot (wired to x1).
If you have room in your case but not your motherboard, it does work.
https://www.amazon.com/Tenext-Quality-Riser-Extender-Ribbon/dp/B0067WZH2Q
This would do just fine (if your case has more slots but the motherboard has only one nearest the video-card.
This is also how you can use the one that gets buried by the video card, too.
They make ones that have the socket on a small board, too, if that's your preference.
4 port bargain sata III controller for <30 USD https://www.amazon.com/IO-Crest-Controller-Non-Raid-SI-PEX40064/dp/B00AZ9T3OU
2 port bargain sata III controller for <12 USD https://www.amazon.com/IO-Crest-Port-PCI-Express-SY-PEX40039/dp/B005B0A6ZS
4 port bargain sata *I* controller + 2 data cable <19$ USD https://www.amazon.com/CTYRZCH-Serial-Adaptor-Controller-Cables/dp/B00R5H1MBC
These are small controllers, very cheap, performance is NOT great, they're mostly pci-express 2.0 though, so they're limited to pci-e x1 2.0 bandwidth limits.
These also may use the poor-performing ASMedia (ugh) controller, however, for extra data storage, it's not all bad.
Feel free to peruse the site for something much better though.

 

Since this is the tech minute, I'll add a recommendation for the "much better" category: https://www.amazon.com/LSI-9210-8i-...pID=51HiWWIF03L&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

The only limitation is that it needs an 8x slot, but those are high-bandwidth, server-grade cards that are especially good at high iops.
Since you have SSDs, that's something to consider. They can do RAID 0-1 or normal SATA/SAS operation and support 8 drives on their own connectors and more if you have an expander board.

Obviously those prices are for used ones, so be careful (eBay may be safer than amazon as I find their feedback system more useable).

 

Yeah, the 9211 series (one off from the 9210 you linked) is pretty good as per reviews, and has an intel chipset and is good for home-server or high-end workstation configs. I use a 9260 here and it works great but is slower with SSD's 4k access than a 9211 would be, but has more options interesting to those higher-end workstations/servers. It's great until the power goes out and the thing starts screaming bloody murder Sure did get to the bottom of the dodgy SSD I had though.
Link for a 9260 is here https://www.amazon.com/SAS9260-8I-Raid-8PORT-sata-512MB/dp/B002IT4YG2/
if anyone's interested, but for those taking the dive for the first time, or using it in their everyday workstations, I'd really say you should go for the 9210/9211 series as it is better suited to disc speed without the battery backup unit requirement.
I don't often link raid cards because they can be more hassle then they're worth, sometimes it's nicer to just have a set-it-and-forget-it setup like highpoint's rocket-RAID setup which is nice, or something simple and cheap like one of those Sata expansion cards.