Sport Mode adjusts these instead of simple offset

Discussion in 'Ideas and Suggestions' started by Michaelflat, Jun 3, 2019.

  1. Michaelflat

    Michaelflat
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    I feel like the sport mode revs the engine wayy too much, it should have like a minimum agression value, and also adjust the agression smoothing parameters (adjusts how fast the agression factor falls for instance) and the hold off after throttle release.. This would probably lead to a better sport mode, the current sport mode is a bit too racy, almost unusable in normal driving (sport mode should be still drivable imo)

    anyway this one is slightly opinionated, so let me know what you think also :)
     
  2. Diamondback

    Diamondback
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    It's modelled pretty closely after what BMW does with the ZF8 in sporty petrol cars (ie x35i/x40i/x50i)
     
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  3. Michaelflat

    Michaelflat
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    I feel like on the ETK 800 it should upshift around 4000rpm or thereabouts from a moderate pullaway, but it winds all the way to the rev limitier... i don't think the BMW car would do this, (try using say 80-90hp in acceleration) and you literally feather the throttle and the agression factor jumps back to 100%.. would be nice to be able to adjust how agressive the sport mode is :) (in a mod)..
     
  4. Diamondback

    Diamondback
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    The ZF8 in these cars is actually quite aggressive in S mode, it's nearly impossible to accelerate quickly but not utterly fast without it shifting several gears down and revving fairly high.
    However, I could certainly expose the aggression offset (atm it's 0.5 iirc) to jbeam I guess.
     
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  5. NOCARGO

    NOCARGO
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    I don't know awful much about many new cars but I do know that many of them have more then one sport (gearbox)mode these
    days, as Mercedes has something like eco/normal/sport/sport+/sport++ . From sport+ on it does gets kinda racy already but the
    genuine 'sport'-assignment is fairly the way more classical sport modes work. For instance, I owned e24 3.5 and e30 2.5 both with
    automatic sport gearboxes and drove the Merc E for several years (and E generations) at work. Those 'classical' sport modes usually
    work as this : they wait a little longer (not too much) for upshift, they downshift faster on throttle and after that same downshift took
    place (and this IS very characteristic about sport modes) they wait (very notably) longer for upshift BUT... at the end, if you drive
    gently in RL 'classical' sport mode (not the sport+ stuff and so) it will respond very gently too. :)
     
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  6. default0.0player

    default0.0player
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    IMO, sport mode should make engine in its power band RPM regardless of throttle position.
    Means the gearbox uses highshiftup/down RPM reagardless of aggression factor.
    Some vehicle use fake "sport" mode, which only upshift a little later, make no use in BeamNG. as you can easily use more throttle to do that.
    Sport mode in BeamNG use primarily as keeping RPM up while throttle is low, such as racing.
    IRL these slightly "sport"-y mode,which does not rev up all the way to power band, use mainly transversing through busy traffic because you cannot see the car in front of the car in front of you so you want to keep RPM a little bit up, but not to the power band because fuel consumption. In beamNG this make no use because this game does not made for traffic jam simulation. You can either race using S mode or drive gently in D mode, progressively drive more aggressive by just increase throttle progressively.

    Also I found a problem, ETK-800 and K-series upshift in M mode cut throttle, wiki says the cut throttle and slow shift only occur in D
     
  7. btcb48

    btcb48
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    Based on YouTube videos of ZF8s (usually a F20-22 35i) and day to day experience with a '14 F30 320i, I would like to share that with the optional sport auto (sport auto = paddles with better software):
    • The lowest possible shift RPM (barely gassing it) in the transmission's S position with engine map in Sport+(DTC) is 2600 to 3000. Tested this in gentle traffic up to 60 kph.
    • Downshift RPM is slightly higher when slowing down after the above, saw something like 1500 compared to around 1000.
    • S position locks out 8th gear. May be different with diesels, or not. ZF8s have a lower max input RPM in 7th and especially 8th.
    • It is possible to eventually settle at normal expressway speeds in 7th gear with the S with Sport+ settings.
    • In manual mode with Sport or Sport+, there is a credible attempt at downshift rev-matching even without brake input. Downshifts are super smooth and fast, engine braking is engaged much more gently than when doing manual downshifts in "Comfort" mode, which doesn't rev-match and possibly only uses EDTC to smooth things a bit.
    What I would love to figure out though, is how aggressively the S with Sport+ combo downshifts under hard braking. (No gas pedal input.) The Stig used manual mode for his M135i hot lap, though it did show that the hardware can handle 4000+ RPM downshifts. Some have said online that the max downshift RPM is only between 2500 and 3500 in S with Sport+. I don't want to incur the brake pad and tire bills just to extensively test this ATM.

    Ideally at max aggression, there should be different max downshift RPM when there is and isn't gas pedal inputs. I added a so called medium shift RPM for the latter and set it so that it will interpolate up to a set limit when more and more brake is applied. (At max aggression, no input downshifts are capped at 2500, max braking brings it to 4000, and it's auto calculated when there's throttle input as before)

    To tone down sport mode, it's modified to multiply the throttle values for aggression instead of adding to the final smoothing. After that, sport mode enforces a minimum aggression value of 0.5. I don't want to step into non linear throttle-input-to-actual-throttle mapping per driving mode. It'll end up too close to an uncanny valley of driving sensation and I'll end up fine tuning it for the next decade...

    Bonus! In normal D modes for "smart" autos, am trying out stepped aggression values to allow for shifting at lower RPM despite higher throttle input than usual.
    E.g. I've set it so that an aggression of 0.49 shifts as though aggression was 0.25, among other ranges.
    This tallies with how the 320i, in D/Comfort mode, doesn't linearly interpolate shift RPM. This isn't sufficiently detailed for a 1-size fit all, but it's a fun thing to try out. Some companies talk about how many programs their autos have and I presume it's related to this.
     
  8. Michaelflat

    Michaelflat
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    Only issue with this is that when the agression factor falls to lower than 0.49 it upshifts too low..

    I spend wayyy too long tuning my transmissions, trying to get the correct power and etc after every shift, why do i bother it's not like you will ever feel the shifts *shrug* :p
     
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