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Have to upgrade to ryzen: what to do?

Discussion in 'Computer Hardware' started by Gnarlex™, Jan 20, 2018.

  1. Gnarlex™

    Gnarlex™
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    A few days ago I was playing Fortnite, when my PC randomly crashed. This has happened a few times since the Intel Meltdown started, and I got used to it. So, I booted my PC back up, started a game, and BOOM, another crash. Same thing happened 5 times. It stopped, until today.
    I was playing FiveM when suddenly, I heard something from my PC, which sounded like a thud, and it just turned off. I tried to start it again, but it wouldn't. So, either the CPU or the mobo blew up, and I don't have any warranty anymore, since Intel's Warranty lasts 3 Years, and I have my pc since the 6600K came out. Same for the mobo.
    I have been thinking about upgrading to ryzen for a while now, but I always thought it wasn't worth it because Ryzen + (or plus?) is coming out in March or something.
    Since I need a PC for school, I have to get a cpu, and since I mostly use my PC for gaming, I thought Ryzen would be okay, since it isn't affected by the meltdown.
    I chose a Ryzen 7 1700, a Coolermaster ML240 RGB, a Gigabyte Gaming K5 and 4 4 gig Sticks of DDR4 3000 Memory.
    Do you guys think I should do it, or should I wait?
     
  2. Instant Winrar

    Instant Winrar
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    Now time for the question I ask several times a week to those looking to buy computer parts... 'Do you need a computer right now?'
    If 'Yes,' then go for it.

    Also, the Gigabyte Gaming 5 (non K) motherboard is near the same price of a K5, but has features closer to that of the K7 if you don't mind white accents. But if the one you're looking at's on sale for less, all's good with your choice.
     
  3. wearyNATE15

    wearyNATE15
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    Id get 2x8 sticks, incase you ever need more. I have the 1700x and I have had no problems (other than my oc i screwed up). Go for it!
     
  4. Gnarlex™

    Gnarlex™
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    No, I live in Germany, right now it costs 50 more, that is why I went with the k5 instead of the 5. Also because of the white accents.
    --- Post updated ---
    Thanks for the tip!
    Yeah, I noticed. I am gonna get a pair of Trident Z RGB's. 180€ right now.
     
  5. wearyNATE15

    wearyNATE15
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    I got the Corsair Vengeance RGB sticks.. not sure price wise how much different they are, but i think they look alot better than the Z's.
     
  6. Gnarlex™

    Gnarlex™
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    Thanks for the tip!
    Yeah, I noticed. I
    I had a pair of RGB's in a other PC that I had to build for a friend, and I thought they looke damazing. :)
     
  7. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Why don't you fix your computer, you'd get higher FPS with an intel chip, but you can run more cars with more cores available (twice as many) on the Ryzen 1700x.
    It's either a power supply, or a motherboard, generally you should sniff around and see if there are bulging or blown caps etc. I'd sooner fix the system if I were you. It's going to be a side-grade apart from more cores, but you will have the upgrade ability better-off with Ryzen.

    POOF or thud generally means the power supply blew it's internal fuse or something burned up. Generally they don't take out other components, but if woefully inadequate for the task, or otherwise overloaded, they can nuke the whole system.
    Get a good PSU and you might be back in the game. If it took out more than that, and it requires more than a motherboard, you can send the board back (from a good retailer anyways, not newegg, their return policy sucks), and go with the Ryzen you wanted.

    Random crashes especially while gaming (under heavy load!), mean a power supply that's over-taxed.
     
  8. Gnarlex™

    Gnarlex™
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    Yep. Power Supply was bricked, which then took the Motherboard and CPU with it :/
    I tested it all since my friend has a spare z board laying around, and the CPU didn't work on my, neither on his board.
    I tried out a different Power Supply with a Phenom X4 and it worked, then I tried mine and it didn't.
    All of these Parts don't have any more Warrenty, which means I can't send them back.
    IF I am going to do something with my PC, I will upgrade it.
    The 6600K was a nice little Machine, but I have started to do more Core/Thread Related tasks, like rendering Videos for a friend.
    Mine is just not really good at it. Sure, it has a Clock Speed of 4.8Ghz before it died, and it ran most games without any problems.
    But Games are getting more and more Power Consuming on the CPU side, like Fortnite or PUBG, also BeamNG.
    These are all Games that I play a LOT.
    It is really annoying when you get a smooth 60FPS but all of the sudden you get huge FPS drops, when the CPU is maxing out its full power and ust isn't able to keep up anymore.
    This is the only reason I really want to upgrade to Ryzen, and I went for an AIO because I want to overclock A bit so I can still get nice Performance in Games that are more on the Clock Speed Side.
     
  9. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Yes, a poor-quality or over-burdened power supply can catastrophically fail and take out many things. Sorry to hear you're out of warranty, then the Ryzen or an intel i5/i7 8xxx series is recommended. If you can afford it, the i7 8700k may be a great deal, if not, the Ryzen 1700x would be a great deal (if you need a cooler with it, buy the non-X 1700. If you don't need one, get the X model as it's just slightly higher-binned & you may get 100~150mhz more OC out of it at the same volts as the non-X model).
    The Ryzen can do what the intel i5/i7 can do, with slightly less per-core clock speeds, but at a better price, though it's relative somewhat (there's still an intel premium to be paid!!!). The Ryzen *IS* a better deal and performs Beamng.drive calculations 10% faster than an intel i7 6900k when you feed it fast 2933mhz dual channel (or better!) memory... so clock speeds are NOT the whole story.
    You should have CLOSE (within 10%) of your rated core speeds if you can get your Ryzen to 4ghz, though most will only get to 3.85 or 3.9ghz, realistically. www.siliconlottery.com may have some good cpu's yet for the Ryzen, not sure. It's worth paying a bit of a premium if you want a good clocker.
    Ryzen prices were reduced ahead of next month's Ryzen-based Vega-graphics-core equipped APU releases (R3 2200G and R5 2400G) , and future 2xxx series Ryzen CPU's coming around April. There will be new Ryzen chipset Z470, however, it doesn't offer much but subtle upgrades over previous, and it is still the same AM4 socket, so cpus that work with AMD Z370, will work with AMD Z470 chipset and vice-versa. The only difference I saw is an x4 PCI-E 3.0 integrated GFX bandwith on the 470 VS an x8 PCI-E 2.0 link on the 370 (it's the same bandwidth, just better use here).


    "Huge drops in performance" happen without hyper-threading, when all cores are busy, and the scheduler has to insert other things, which in turn must wait, and be processed by the cpu in short-order, holding everything up until then.
    Hyper-threading makes this wait a lot more seamless, and inserts the next 'order' for the cpu with the core with the oldest process currently active, meaning, the scheduler is making sure all the orders are ready and in cache memory on the CPU so the very millisecond that the CPU is done with the first task it got, it can take on this one, and go right back to whatever else it needs to do. The OS sees these 'hyperthreaded' or AMD's SMT-aware cpu's as 2x as many cores because this is how the CPU scheduler can receive the commands from the OS ahead of time. It basically lets the cpu intelligently multi-task a whole-lot better than the software or OS could try to (though sometimes patches help, as with Windows 7 scheduler patches for older AMD FX cpus).
    Basically, what I am saying is, if you don't do a whole lot at once on your PC, and don't mind closing the web browser before playing a multi-core aware game/program, and don't want to run a Media Player program for music while you game in a multi-core aware game/program, you're fine with an i5, or Ryzen 3 CPU.
    If you want to do more than one thing at once, get a hyper-threaded CPU. There's a day and night difference for highly-threaded apps because of the lack of delay in getting things into the scheduler on the CPU, getting things loaded in cache, and getting things done without notable interruption.

    Examples:
    Cities Skylines runs much much MUCH smoother at the same GHZ speed with Hyperthreading/SMT on than without it. Without it, there's a lot of skips in the audio, and noticeable pauses in the simulation.
    Many open world games with lots of AI like GTAV perform much better with more cores and HT/SMT.
    Running various different vehicles in Beamng.drive at once, like a commercial truck and many cars, or the same big truck and a bunch of pianos, not all things are created equal in demands of physics processing. So everything would have to often wait for the truck, and go the speed at which your computer could process said truck. Someone can correct me if I am wrong here a bit about Beamng processing. Physics processes and AI processes benefit from larger cache of higher-class CPUs also.
    Running a game requiring 4 cores and also streaming, on a 4 core 8 thread processor (HT/SMT). This will be much smoother with hyperthreading or SMT enabled, then without, as it can multitask much more efficiently. That is not to say it will be 100% as smooth as just running the game alone.

    Basically, there's a bit of a delay, in sending an instruction to the CPU and getting it done & back to the OS/software level, sometimes longer than the time it needs to process the instruction itself!
    So when you have more tasks than cores on the CPU you wish to buy, you buy a CPU with HT/SMT on it, so that you can do more, and wait less.

    --Hope this helps!
     
  10. Gnarlex™

    Gnarlex™
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    Well, the only reason I do not want a Intel CPU right now, is because of the meltdown. I know, it sounds dumb, but I really am a FPS freak, and I don't play Cities, i'd rather play beamng or GTA V.
    Anything like that.
    I would consider getting a 8700K if the Meltdown gets fixed soon.
    Thanks for the super long post!

    EDIT: I just looked at the prices for the 8700K and 8600K, and I am going to bin that idea. I really can't afford it right now :/
    I think i'll go with the 1800X or 1700X right now, and as I said i'll go for an AIO untill I get a new GPU and be able to do some custom watercooling.
    My brother will get my 1080, and I will order a 1080ti and watercool the whole system since I have some experience doing that.

    EDIT 2:
    So, I was looking over Amazon for some Intel CPU's, and I found the 7800X. I have no Idea if this is A good CPU, since I don't focus on the Skylake X chips.
    I know I need a X299 Mainboard.
    I found a MSI X299 SLI Plus for a reasonable price, so i'd give it a try.
    The 7800X is also a 6/12 CPU, same like the 8700K.
    Sorry for bothering you.
     
    #10 Gnarlex™, Jan 24, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018
  11. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Yeah sorry I do write a book, but communication is a wonderful thing.
    To a certain extent, the meltdown and spectre bugs (or atleast one of those) affect BOTH brand CPUs.
    You'd have to do some reading on www.guru3d.com (safe for work link). Just go back a few pages for the info, if you haven't read up on it 100% yet.
    If you're going X299, keep in mind those CPU's aren't soldered together any more and you may have heating issues there, though if you're going water-cooling, that's a good start. Consider Threadripper CPUs if you're going to be spending a lot of money there. It isn't going to OC as far (4~4.15ghz max generally), but you're not going to catch Polar Bears on fire and drown the Earth with the amount of heat you throw out with an X299 system :) Though, that being said, the X299 may provide some more gaming performance if you get the clocks above 4.4ghz or so on the chip. Ryzen-class desktop chips also routinely out-performed intel i7 6900k's on x99 by up to 10+ % at same clocks on Beamng calculations for physics, so clock speed isn't the end-all.
    In the end though, either one you snag, will be a nice upgrade into multi-core domain. Generally speaking, an i7 8xxx system will be a dead end (the high-end mainstream boards will have no newer line-up of CPUs for them), where the Ryzen and ThreadRipper X399, and possibly the intel X299 chipset, will all have newer CPUs sooner or later to upgrade to. So if you plan to keep the machine for a few years, it's definitely a sound investment to get a higher-class chipset.
    It's your money & whatever you do is on you - best wishes and hope the build goes well & exceeds expectation.
     
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