These 2 statements seem to contradict eachother?... Forza(and Gran Turismo too) is rubbish arcade crap compared to some games out there. Go play Live for Speed, Assetto Corsa, IRacing... then come back and tell me how "realistic" Forza is. Seriously... Forza? The closest to real life? Have you ever seen how their suspension magically gets rid of force it can't handle? It's complete and utter crap and nothing like real life. In fact, even BeamNG is way more realistic than Forza... It's not anywhere near close for actual racing simulation, but it's definitely more realistic than Forza for regular driving.
Something potato pointed out in another thread and I had to fire my xbox up to check, no body roll, even on the high centre of gravity heavy range rover I had on stock springs... It just stayed flat on the 3rd person view until I hit the apex of the turn, the camera did move in first person though?
The thing with Forza, like Mythbuster said (and Gabe many, many times over), is the suspension magically copes with huge landings, bumps, rumble strips. Their tire model is, from what I can tell through my controller, really good. It should be, they worked with Perelli. My issue with Forza comes when you can change rear camber on a solid rear axle muscle car. How is that possible unless they're using a generic geometry setup? BeamNG lacks with the tire model at the moment. It works decent, but to compare it to racing games where you're timed down to the .001 of a second, its a bit lacking right now. What IS realistic, is looking at BeamNG in the sense that, it's a physics simulator. You CAN'T fake things in BeamNG. Suspensions have to work like suspensions, vehicle construction, wings for flying, ect. Any other racing game you look at, has to code all these different scenarios out. Also, I'm dying to find out... What do you "racedrive"?
i have determined from this thread that: - we have to wait for the race update or else any opinion on the steering/friction model is invalid to talk about on the forum and will be heavily opposed - the frequent posters on this forum will never agree that the cars in beamng slide too much when performing turns that a normal car can handle fine (ever driven a car at 60mph on a highway? i don't see people oversteering and sliding off the road when taking basic turns) - forza, a multi-million dollar game who has partnered closely with many physicists and tire companies, is *extremely* unrealistic in all regards simply because gabester noted how the game seems to discard some forces a long time ago - the author of this thread has no idea what he's talking about, he's obviously falsely claiming to be a "racedrive" and is not credible at all - SixSixSixSeven is a professional race driver with massive expertise ranging from arcade video games like Forza to real-life F1 racing - the author's posts are invalid because beamng's exponential steering model is *way too unrealistic* compared to a real life steering wheel, and of course we are assuming that the OP is using a keyboard and not a steering wheel or controller. --- it's really disappointing to read these threads. they pop up pretty often and are always filled with the same people trying to justify the game *against* what the author has to say rather than simply admitting that beamng has room for improvement. the only decent thing said in this thread so far: and the only real response to this, which nobody has said, is that the dev's are aware and actively working on it; sorry for the inconvenience. search for the thread talking about static friction vs dynamic friction, read the latest blog entry talking about how they've identified bugs in friction model, and read the beamng lua code regarding sliding forces for more information.
I mean, I kind of understand where the OP is coming from, some of the cars are a bit "floaty"... but you have to realize this game is in version 0.1........it's still a looooooong way from being finished. The tyre model could use some work, yes, but it's not THAT bad considering the games build. With features that you're used to in these console "simulators"...things like speed sensitive steering and adjustable throttle and brake deadzones and linearity and what not, of course those games will feel more manageable, it tries to simulate on a controller what your normal actions would be when driving in RL... Beam doesn't have those....at least not yet. I guarantee even at 30mph...if I were to go from completely straight to full steering lock in .5 seconds, my tail would want to whip around, even in my 4700 lb., 18.1 ft. long x 6.6 ft. wide caprice wagon on surprisingly sticky all-terrains.
record yourself or find a video of anybody, in any vehicle, completing a competitive lap time without sliding, oversteering, or counter-steering.
It would be impossible without a competitive steering setup....or some sort of steering aids like ^^^^^^ Though I was admittedly quite surprised at how well the Grand Marshall handled Laguna Seca when I tried it some weeks back... Edit: it's version 0.3......my bad....looks like a 1 on my screen at the distance I sit from my screen....nevertheless....still a very long way to go before it's finished, and there are tweaks in progress to the tyre model...so back to my original point...give it time
Well, i didint mean it, Forza in truly not closest game for car handling at all. If you truly want realism, you have to go PC-games. I would to be nice in GTA, but not in Forza, because then all the amateur casual drivers would to crash their cars all over places, because oversteering Aaah, good ol Forza vs. Gran Turismo. My opinion is still, than Forza is little closer to realism than Gran Turismo, i have played both, and noticed than Gran Turismo has same basic arcade driving feeling what was in GT2 (my first love, btw.) I noticed huge difference between Froza 3 and 4, Forza 4 was far more realistic than 3 when it came in. (Havent try out Forza 5 tho.) When Gran Turismo 5 came out, all my frends was disappointed for car handling, it feels exactly same arcade as Granturismo 4, but at least photos look dam good. Still, they both are pretty arcade. Hmm. It is really same as Froza and more arcade point to point. It looks more realistic in photos, which crate illusion of realistic handling, but is not. Oblivious troll is too oblivious... There was post to body roll to sideways, there is pic to body roll in extreme acceleration. Body roll is simulated in every way, in hypersupercars bodyroll is so minimal, than it feels like it not there at all.
In this point you're right. Listen, I know what I'm talking about but you don't listen to what I want to say. I don't say forza is realistic over all, I've never said that. I know that forza is not very realistic and beamNG is far more, but you don't see my point. Maybe I've said it wrong. What I wanted to say is that the grip, AND ONLY THE GRIP, is better and more realistic than in beamNG. I've never talked about the suspension or the physics or anything, thats not the sense of this thread. I just said that the grip the cars have in beamNG is not realistic because the are sliding too much. That's all I ever wanted to say. Understand? Sorry if I said it wrong. Real life F1 racing? So please tell me his name or SixSixSixSeven tell me your name because if he is a F1 driver or was a F1 drive I'll know him. Or if not google does so please tell me. And if so I have great respect of him. But please I want to know who he is. If he's a proffessional race drive like you said.
He's joking about SixSixSevenSeven, I'm pretty sure he isn't a professional racing driver. I can definitely sense the sarcasm anyway.
There is another thing that BeamNG has over other games and that's body flexure. I know its minimal but having done work experience with engineers who closely work with racing cars I can tell you in high speed races they do take it into account and yes, they take steps sometimes to rigidify a car body. Part of race car maintenance is also on the car's body itself and keeping it from loosening up. BeamNG is the only game with a HOPE of simulating such a thing properly. What we lose in the tyre model for now we gain in the fact that the suspension and the car's actual frame and structure all have involvement in dealing with driving forces when you go over bumps, around corners or simply brake and accelerate. Hence the cars in NG bounce and roll and flex and wobble far more realistically than any rigid body system has a vague chance of replicating.
you are totally right but the point of this thread was the bad handling cars have due to the tires and not anything else. People like Mythbuster who said BeamNG is far more realistic are right. I agree with all of them, but they are talking about the overall driving and not about the tires which I meant. I just say that the tires have too less grip and thats true. and it's also true that this is better in other games like forza. Anything else isn't relavant in this thread because I was talking about the tires and not the suspensions and stuff. I guess everyone missed that. And if they missed it because I haven't said it clearly than sorry for that. But you know now so stop talking about other things.
my comments were satirical in nature, no offense meant to you. sixsixsixseven spoke as if he were the only authority on realism in games vs real life, and others began to question your own experience in driving for no reason. i exaggerated their ideas to show how dumb it sounds.
Cheers for being a dick. Did I claim to be an F1 driver? No I said to go and look on youtube for F1 footage of the same era the OP claimed was fine, very tail happy. Did I say BeamNG was perfect? No. Did I claim to be the only authority on video games? No. Does the OP contradict himself? Yes, infact OP, while your at it trying to find out who I am in the racing world why don't you tell us who you are in the racing world. And yeah, I have switched lanes at 60mph. No the tyres don't squeel all over the place, nor do they in BeamNG unless you are using a keyboard in which case the steering tries to go full lock which anyone with a modicum of common sense knows won't work, a real car you would barely have to move the steering wheel at all, so little infact that its bordering on the minimum an xbox 360 thumbstick is capable of registering accurately for BeamNG's purposes. This is the bigger issue in BeamNG, steering input, try an actual steering wheel with the game and steer as if it was a real car and its massively improved. Full lock at 20 or 30mph is idiotic, let alone 60, but the OP and you are both über l33t pr0 ninja race drivers right so you already knew that...
I think you guys will be pretty happy with the handling updates coming in the race update Both in the form of extensive tire tuning and some changes to the friction code and groundmodels. The cars are sharper and stickier without having an unrealistically high amount of grip (we actually had to reduce the friction coefficient on the tires during the process). The Bolide 390 GTR shows the handling improvements the best - it's crazy fast, sharp, grippy, and a blast to drive
I'd like a good teaser video showing the next updates. Maybe replace the main websites video and everything. We need something new to advertise the realism and features coming to the game. When u load up the site and see a year old video to a work in progress game it kinda leaves some to be desired ya know?
Was about to ask about this, until I found out. Friction at asphalt is waay too low. Hope to see this update soon
That makes me wonder if they'll get to the point of simulating the torque and what that does to a body... on drag cars and high powered motors with high traction, you can actually see the body twist... If I'm not mistaken, Chrysler/Mopar put an extra leaf spring on the right side to counteract that from the factory back in the 60's and 70's.
