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Powertrain Feedback Collection

Discussion in 'Microblogs' started by Diamondback, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. Diamondback

    Diamondback
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    Vehicle Systems Lead
    BeamNG Team

    Joined:
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    Hello everyone,

    Our team would like to hear your feedback regarding the powertrain system and its configuration.

    In the past, we sometimes configured things incorrectly or didn't consider possible areas of use and behavior. We want to hear more about such issues and use-cases.
    We would like to keep this thread focused on reproduce-able bugs, issues, and oversights on our part for specific missing use-cases or things that feel weird with the powertrain.

    Please share your thoughts below but keep the following restrictions in mind as we want to keep this thread manageable.

    Posts that don't follow the guidelines will be removed, we invite you to bring them to the Ideas & Suggestions section instead, where you can post using any format you prefer.
    We will still collect and process them.

    Rules:
    • Please use the post template at the bottom of this post
    • Only one post per topic or issue is allowed
    • The post must be very clear on what the topic is exactly (please check this post as an example)
    • The post should include details as to what happens now and what behavior you would expect to happen
    • You may use videos in the post as a supporting reference
    We will collect presented issues and feedback and setup dedicated threads for further discussion about individual items at team's discretion. Please hold your comments on the posted items to a minimum until then.


    Before posting:
    • Make sure to update the game to the latest version
    • Make sure to run the game in Safe Mode
    • Make sure to use the post template below

    Post template:
    Code:
    The topic/issue to bring up is...
    (clearly identify what you are talking about)
    
    This happens when...
    (include reproduction steps)
    
    Instead it should...
    (explain what behavior you expected)
    
    My specs are...
    (include information about your hardware - CPU, GPU, RAM, input methods, etc.)
     
    • Like Like x 25
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. _Tanco

    _Tanco
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    The most obvious issue I have with torque converter automatic transmissions is the small rpm jumps that happens when the gearbox upshifts at low rpm with moderate throttle input

    the problem is pretty easy to reproduce, you can take the etk856d (it's the car where the bug is the most obvious to see, but it happens on every tc gearbox, even with the wentward), select "D" mode, and accelerate at 25% of throttle and you will immediately see what im talking about. I made a video one year ago showing the issue (it still react exactly the same way in 0.22, this problem makes me go crazy while using those gearboxes, it's so unsatisfying)

    In my opinion the rpms should simply reduce without having this rpm raise before reducing brutaly

    my spec are : i5-4440S, AMD Radeon R9 200 series, 8GB of ram, playing with keyboard/gamepad/wheel

    That's a really nice idea to ask the community about all the problems they found about powertrains, as automatic transmission bother me a lot in this game, thanks :D !

     
    #2 _Tanco, Apr 23, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 28
    • Like Like x 3
  3. Michaelflat

    Michaelflat
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    Automatic transmission thermals.
    Please

    Can't be hugely different codewise to manuals and their clutch thermals. Would be nice to overheat an auto gearbox towing a 6 tonne boulder through utah with a measly 4.5L petrol pickup.
     
    • Agree Agree x 32
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  4. cheems_samurai

    cheems_samurai
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    The most annoying thing is how unrealistically engines break during a crash.

    This happens when I have a massive crash in Utah and the engine is hanging out, but I can still rev the engine.

    Instead it should be immediately broken as it would be in real life.

    My specs are RTX 2070 super, i9 10900f, 32 gig ram
    --- Post updated ---
     
    • Agree Agree x 12
    • Like Like x 1
  5. ast5515

    ast5515
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    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2013
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    The topic/issue to bring up is automatic transmission aggression going up when stopped

    This happens when I come to a complete stop with any vehicle equipped with the adaptive aggression system (SBR, ETK800, Vivace/Tograc, Sunburst). Aggression goes up to 75-ish %, causing the first shift from first to second to happen at a higher than desired RPM. Especially problematic with DCTs because their first to second shifts at 3500 RPM and low throttle can be quite rough.

    Instead it should freeze the aggression counter when reaching the idle speed of first gear, or let's say below 10 km/h.

    My specs are:
    i7 5820k
    16 gb DDR4 3200 MHz
    RTX 2070
     
    • Agree Agree x 10
  6. atv_123

    atv_123
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    Well... it really depends on "how" things get broken. In real life, as long as all the wires don't get ripped (the older the car, the easier of a time it will have getting around this issue), the fuel lines stay intact, and the oil pan isn't ruptured... the engine could still run even if its sitting on the ground outside of the car. Now, yes, the likelihood of that happening just right is slim to none, and usually their isn't enough play in the lines (fuel lines mostly) for something like this to happen. But it is possible.

    Granted, I have seen in beam sometimes the engine gets full on yeeted from the vehicle and somehow the engine just keeps running like there is nothing wrong... now that, I agree, should never happen. More than likely though this is down to the mod maker not including beams that when broken are designed to do exactly that... kill the engine.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  7. _Tanco

    _Tanco
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    Another pretty weird issue about DCTs (even tho most problems got fixed with the recent improvements, this one didn't got fixed (or at least entirely fixed)) : when downshifting 4 speeds (this bug doesn't happen when downshifting more or less speed, I even tried with downshfiting 7 speeds and it worked perfectly), the rpm will raise to max rpm then reduce a few thousands rpm to finally raise again to the desired rpms, this makes downshifting really brutal and really long in those case, which is a bit annoying as it happens quite often to downshift 4 speeds (for example 7->3rd gear)

    it's pretty easy to reproduce this problem : take any dct of the game, put the higher gear as possible, put the game in pause, downshift 4 gear and reactivate the simulation

    In my opinion the downshift should be smoother, the same way as a the dct do while downshifting 3 or 2 or even 5 gears, for some reason it only happens when downshifting 4 gears, it happens too when downshifting 6 gears on the etk DCT only, but it's so unusual to downshift 6 gears that it makes the issue less problematic in this case

    my spec are : i5-4440S, AMD Radeon R9 200 series, 8GB of ram, playing with keyboard/gamepad/wheel
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Dothero

    Dothero
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    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2018
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    The CVT gearbox don't let the engine revs up to it's maximal rpm. When using the stock CVT config, the cvt transmission revs up to the redline (around 6000 rpm) at full throttle, but when you put another engine and move the redline to 8500 rpm, the gearbox still doesn't want the engine to rev higher than 6000 rpm, even if you can get a bonus 100 hp at 7500 rpm.

    This happens everytime you put an engine with a redline higher than 6000 rpm with a CVT transmission.

    Instead, the engine should find at wich rpm you get the higher amount of power (while being under the redline) and set the CVT to begin to change gear only when reaching it (only at full throttle). (Or maybe add an ECU part to the CVT where you can choose between stock settings and custom settings).

    My specs are : Intel I5 6500 @ 3.2ghz, Msi 1060 3gb, 8gb of Ram playing mainly with G29, sometimes xbox controller and keyboard

    Stock engine :


    With tune engine :
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  9. Damian Peggs

    Damian Peggs
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    I was talking about this a couple of days ago on a beamng facebook group. we were discussing how nice it would be to have a hud/ai tool that only repaired selected components in the powertrain or in general. like if you are drifting around and blow the head gasket or bust the radiator. just click the buttons and they are repaired but the rest of the vehicles still beat up.

    also breakable differential gears would be cool
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Agent_Y

    Agent_Y
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    The topic to bring up is that you can have 2 engines and 2 transmissions at a time, but only 1 of the transmissions is shiftable, which makes this option completely useless.

    This happens when your vehicle has 2 engines and each has its own transmission, when you shift only one of them is affected, the other stays in neutral forever, while the throttle input affects both engines. Additionally, even in the arcade gearbox behavior, the second transmission never leaves neutral gear.

    Instead it should shift normally in arcade behavior, and maybe shifting one of the transmissions manually should also affect the other one, or it could be possible to bind separate inputs to it somehow without creating a whole new custom transmission LUA like some modders have done before.

    My specs are not relevant because it happens regardless of the specs, but I can mention that I shift with a keyboard. (Yes I know this post is dumb and useless but at least it's better than 99% of the other ones so far lol)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. McBeamer94

    McBeamer94
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    deleted
     
    #11 McBeamer94, Apr 23, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Penguin72

    Penguin72
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    I just gotta say that the shiftlogic for the auto transmission in the 200BX is awful. The transmission will randomly shift up or down, and 90% of the time is in a gear that is too high or too low.

    What does that have to do with powertrains?
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
  13. default0.0player

    default0.0player
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    Everyone tries this: Drive the DT40L Highway, use 75% throttle during acceleration and watch the tachometer.

    OT:
    The DCT upshifting RPM from 1st to 2nd is too high even the jbeam value is low. For example the 8DCT in the ETK800, the jbeam upshift rpm is 2100 but it won't upshift below 3000RPM even if you use 5% throttle more than 10 seconds.
    It should shift according to the jbeam value in 1st as in other gears.
    My spec are i7-7700HQ, 1050Ti, 8GB RAM, input method a joystick.

    EDIT: The 0.22 update updated the DCT so it will downshift when driving on water, please do the same on the Automatic Transmissions as well.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  14. Evans1310

    Evans1310
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    Aug 24, 2013
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    Something i would like to see is semi race tyres, we have sport and race but id like something in-between just like the brake pads, i feel a semi slick would be a good addition to the tuner presets. Another suggestion is allowing the nitrous to come in and then switch off past another rpm (eg 2500-6000)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. Chargedm90

    Chargedm90
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    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    2
    The topic/issue to bring up is...
    Method of drivetrain designing.

    This happens when...
    Any time the drivetrain parameters or selections are changed.

    Instead it should...
    I believe a system of being able to create new engine and transmission configurations, and the ability to create different vehicle configurations, should have its own dedicated GUI and section in the game.

    The natural inclination is to point to the Automation game, however my suggestion is sufficiently different enough from that game to warrant its own work. Automation has many features that are not as neccesary for the consumer level beamNG experience (body morphing and custom fixtures), and has many critical limitations (especially longer travel suspension and tire types and behavior, and translation of handling balance from one game to the other)

    [As a side note, I would absolutely dream of having custom body morph and fixtures, along with custom engine designer, with an intuitive gui in beam NG, but understand that may be a pipe dream)

    Anyway, fundamentally the process for even just selecting different parts for an existing vehicle is clunky and opaque. For example, when I select the racing three speed transmission for the pickup truck, there is no indication that it's gearing is incredibly short. It also tends to take a lot of time in-game to make these changes. With slight loading lag when selections are made, and the menu itself being hard to use efficiently.

    I believe a dedicated GUI and game environment would help with this.

    By extension, this GUI could also allow for more extensive information of the different parts characteristics, and possibly even offer more detailed adjustments to parts themselves. Say for example that there's no reason the three speed racing transmission needs to be geared so short. Or that adding a light bar or fire extinguisher increases weight.

    Also, I may be making a mistake by not knowing that gearing can be changed in-game, a GUI would make it so that the ability to change that gearing is more clearly presented to me.

    My specs are...
    Ryzen 9 4900H, RTX 2060 Max Q 16gb Ram
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Trophy

    Trophy
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    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2019
    Messages:
    1,643
    The topic/issue to bring up is ignition damage on the pickup.

    This happens when you hit something with the front of the pickup and shake the engine around.

    Usually, the damage starts as not very severe, but over time it gets worse and worse even if you don't hit another car/object. On other cars, it's much harder to damage the ignition system.

    Instead of getting damaged easily and the damage slowly becoming worse, the damage should be less severe, and not get worse over time.

    3 other problems I have include clutch engage on certain engines, the dct transmissions, induction damage, and a bug with oil starvation.

    Clutch on manuals and sequentials: with clutch assist on, in first gear, with some transmissions (for example the sequential on the legran), the clutch partially engages between around idle to 3k rpm to start moving. Then it fully engages, but towards the top end, it disengages a bit again (around 20%). Only in first gear when accelerating. It should not re-disengage at the top of the rev range.

    DCT transmissions: With DCTs in first gear, you guys added a feature that disengages the clutch. This gets annoying, especially when youre driving on a track. My suggestion is to only make this feature work in comfort mode, and not in other modes.

    Induction damage: On some cars (especially the sbr4) it is far too easy to damage the induction systems. The sbr4 is a rear engine vehicle, so it shouldn't damage it in frontal collisions.

    Oil starvation bug: on body on frame vehicles, sometimes damaging the frames in certain ways causes the engine to starve of oil even when it is right side up. This can be seen clearly with the hopper, and using the nodegrabber to pull the frame rails down to touch the ground. Also with some cars in sun gravity.

    My specs are: I5-9300h, nvidia gtx 1650 max q, 16 gb of 2666mhz ram, more info in my signature.
    (include information about your hardware - CPU, GPU, RAM, input methods, etc.)
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 2
  17. Asem1123

    Asem1123
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    Aug 10, 2017
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    Automatic transmissions with locking torque converters sometimes "blip" as much as 500 rpm when unlocking to shift to the next gear at low rpm, specifically in-between locked gears (e.g.: 3rd to 4th, 4th to 5th, etc.). Also after the blip because of the locking release, it just instantly goes 100% lock and the rpm drop is very abrupt. Most noticeable on the Wentward bus, and all new Gavril models which all share a common powertrain. Diesel Gavrils have it worse because they have so much torque at so low rpm, and they use the same torque converter as the gas models.

    Usually increasing the torque converter diameter fixes it, but then that messes around with the drivability. Maybe try to design a half-lock (somewhat PWM) system for the locking torque converters that eliminates or minimalizes the blip and smooths out the shift in-between "locked gears". (Also add larger torque converters for diesel gavrils).

    My specs are...
    Intel Core i7 9750H
    16GB DDR4-2667
    NVIDIA GTX 1650
    Input method: Mouse

    Video:
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  18. CarTurbo

    CarTurbo
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    Aug 14, 2020
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    Is it possible to simulate thermals in BeamNG?
     
  19. Bifdro

    Bifdro
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    Sep 29, 2017
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    This already in game
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  20. KrakenEX

    KrakenEX
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    Mar 27, 2016
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    I know it's borderline off-topic but I would LOVE to see tire thermals
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
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