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Powertrain Feedback Collection

Discussion in 'Microblogs' started by Diamondback, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. The Stig Is A Spy

    The Stig Is A Spy
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    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2018
    Messages:
    67
    I'm not sure how big of an issue this currently is, but would it be feasible to allow for a drivetrain configuration that uses a combustion engine and motor that run at the same time within the same vehicle, but independently of each other? For example, such a feature would allow for AWD hybrids like the Honda NSX (NC1) and numerous 2010s Le Mans Prototypes with energy recovery systems without requiring additional work on the Lua end.

    Of course, since I lack experience in such an area (having tried such an arrangement without Lua and promptly given up), feel free to correct me if I'm overstating the problem.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  2. gtaman788

    gtaman788
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    Maybe a Tune thing for damage. lets say you spawn a car. And you want to have blown piston rings.

    You will be able to slide it to say its at X% of damage.


    Also Fluid level adjuster. I.E Cooling system at 100% But slide it to 63% Or What ever.


    Same with out. I will love to see how long engines last with Minimal oil :)
     
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  3. vmlinuz

    vmlinuz
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    This is even more noticeable on the LeGran with locking torque converter, the RPM jumps really high when shifting. The actual shift points could use some work too, it's really hard to convince it to downshift.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Cheifdg

    Cheifdg
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    Mar 15, 2021
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    for me is when i release the gas pedal on manual transmission [and also with all gearboxs assist off] the rpm going down while in real life the rpm will stay while speed go down.



    this my video:


    pc specs: i7 10700,rtx 2060,32 gigbytes of ram,playing on keyboard/mouse/gamepad
     
  5. Aari

    Aari
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    Sep 26, 2020
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    155
    I would like to see different engines and stuff like a v12 or a boxer 6 or a 2 stroke 3 cylinder or any 2 stroke motor
     
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  6. fionafhil 2

    fionafhil 2
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    Oct 15, 2015
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    I would like to see the ability to downshift at speed with manual transmissions and delete my connecting rods from my Engine block please thank you.
     
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  7. Kolas

    Kolas
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    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2018
    Messages:
    93
    The topic/issue to bring up is...
    Since the game has been updated to engage the clutch when simultaneously accelerating and braking while stationary, in manual and non-ABS vehicles, basic gearbox behavior sometimes locks the wheels while driving.

    This happens when...
    While cruising or driving fast if the wheels locks up while quick hard braking and let go the vehicle as it is for a some time, the basic gearbox behavior in manual vehicles drops shifts to first gear while going idle and if the idle cruising speed is more than the dropped gear's speed range, wheels locks up.

    Instead it should...
    If it has been idling for a while and has not lost speed, it may not downshift to first gear, at least.
     
  8. LucasBE

    LucasBE
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    Mar 22, 2015
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    no, the exact same thing happens in real life.
     
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  9. RcCoockie

    RcCoockie
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    Feb 24, 2018
    Messages:
    10
    It may differ between vehicles, this is what I found in a few real cars:
     

    Attached Files:

    • 5FBEA1C7-E392-4D6B-AAEC-B461A2F15347.jpeg
  10. The Gas Station

    The Gas Station
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    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2016
    Messages:
    254
    The topic/ issue is transfer cases, differentials, lockable hubs.

    I would also like to address being able to engage diff-locks and low-range while driving. I know different cars have different systems, and some vehicles have to be stationary to change differential locks, low-range or 4wd (I know there are also some which are the other way around, where 4wd can only engage while moving), all these systems are prone to damage when used incorrectly, just like shifting without the clutch. There's already a system in-game that causes this type of damage to the transmission. Why not have the same for the diffs, transfer case etc? So if you switch to low-range while moving, or if you use a 4wd 50/50 system on hard pavement in an abusive way (which is not as bad, but also hurts the transfer-case), the system would absorb damage and eventually break down?
    And also, it could have a "safety net" or "Easy mode" option in the menus (like the gearbox has, which auto-engages the clutch and prevents shifts to a gear too low). The safety net would prevent shifting to/from 4wd when conditions are unfit, or wait with the shift until it is fit, like some modern electronically- activated transfer-cases do (where there's no lever, but a button on the dashboard instead).

    To sum it up:
    What happens now:
    low-range, diff-lock, and 4wd systems can be activated when stationary, when moving, and at any speed.
    Instead it shoud:
    Either not activate, or activate and cause damage to the drivetrain system, if activated in conditions which it's not supposed to be activated/deactivated in. Also, the system should absorb damage over time when locked if on hard surfaces, due to stress caused when turning in high-grip.

    Another Idea I have is that locking the hubs in vehicles could be a really awesome "trigger" for walking mode. So, you could get out of your Roamer and lock the hubs, like how you can close the bed on the D-series. It could add more immersion to off-roading.

    What should happen:
    While in walking mode, when approaching the front axle of a car or truck with lockable hubs, a red "trigger" should appear, enabling you to lock the hubs akin to how you would do so IRL.

    And, another thing I thought about but I'm pretty unsure about, is an engine brake. I know truck and bus drivers use these all the time, and it's a pretty significant feature of heavyweight vehicles' engines. However I have no idea if it's a good idea to implement from a player-experience perspective- there are just not enough buttons on the keyboard!
    Then again, you could move buttons from keyboard to the "app" (where the start/stop engine, and all the drivetrain diff / transfer case toggle buttons and ESC buttons are). For example, why not put the headlights and high beams and sirens over there? Then, there will be plenty of buttons available on the keyboard, some could use for an engine brake, or for any other interesting features.

    Specs: Intel i5 (6th gen I don't remember exactly which one) proccessor, 8 Gb ram, Nvidia 750Gtx 2gb ram Graphics card, and an Xbox controller+keyboard.
     
    • Agree Agree x 9
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  11. NoDakSmack

    NoDakSmack
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    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2018
    Messages:
    160
    The topic/issue to bring up is...
    more damage functions for transmissions

    This happens when you..
    Accrued damage for automatic trans gears that stacks from aggressive shifting and results in losing gears
    A breakgroup for trans case, when broken loses trans fluid and start to miss shifts
    Trans fluid levels, temperature & trans coolers, affects speed of shifts, losing and finding gears

    My specs are...
    Ryzen 9 3950x, 1070, 32gb ram
     
    #51 NoDakSmack, Apr 24, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 7
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  12. P_enta

    P_enta
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    3,003
    offtopic but they made a 4000 series?? I didn’t know that.

    I also second this comment, automatic transmissions can be damaged too, ya know.
     
  13. NoDakSmack

    NoDakSmack
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    Dec 24, 2018
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    Typo, fixed :) Yes there's a lot that can be done with transmission simulation yet
     
  14. NGAP NSO Shotgun Chuck

    NGAP NSO Shotgun Chuck
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    Mar 6, 2015
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    1,247
    THIS. Being able to lock out overdrive would easily solve the infuriating tendency of 4-speed automatics in this game to rush straight into 4th as soon as you back off slightly from full throttle, or immediately if you wind out second before upshifting. The 200BX is probably the worst for this, with the I-series a close second; the V8 Wendovers also do this (V6 doesn't seem to be as bad) though that one's fourth gear isn't much taller than third so it isn't as annoying. In my experience, the Gavril automatics do this the least.

    And yes, there is plenty of real-life precedent for these types of functions. I have directly observed the "separate positions for D and OD" setup in an early-1990s Ford Explorer, and the XTerra I mentioned before had a 5-speed automatic with a PRND321 shift order but also an "O/D OFF" button on the shifter that supplied the missing "4". The owner's manual listed some very odd maximum speeds for each position which clearly bore no relation to the actual redline-limited top speed in each gear, so I can only assume that transmission wasn't built to be shifted manually.
    --- Post updated ---
    I thoroughly enjoyed using the previous clutch functionality to brake-torque manuals, though I admit it's not the most realistic. What's more annoying is that, when driving a car without ABS, if you lock the drive wheels and the game's anti-stall function kicks in to disengage the clutch, it will now stay disengaged until you tap the throttle - and automatics do this too. It makes non-ABS cars ten times more difficult to drive quickly because even a quick lockup will completely disable all engine braking.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  15. glen

    glen
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    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2017
    Messages:
    311
    How come for any automatic transmission, whether a 3-speed or a 6-speed, is it always P R N D 2 1? If it’s P R N D 2 1, does that mean every car is a 3 speed?
     
  16. dxg1997

    dxg1997
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    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2013
    Messages:
    47
    The topic/issue to bring up is...
    1. A way to change fueling is something I've been pining after for a while. I.E., If I put a large supercharger or turbo onto a vehicle, it auto adds the fuel it needs. I want to be able to swap out injectors if I need to, and monitor my AFR's. If I put a large form of boost onto a vehicle, without upgrading fueling (Carb, Injectors, Fuel pump, fuel type) then it could lean out and blow up.

    This happens when...
    N/A

    Instead it should...
    Have fueling options for various vehicles, as well as optional tuning tables.

    My specs are...
    CPU: Ryzen 7 3800X
    GPU: 2x GTX 1070's
    RAM: 64 GB 3200 mHz
    MOBO: MSi Gaming Edge Wifi X570
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
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  17. NGAP NSO Shotgun Chuck

    NGAP NSO Shotgun Chuck
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    This would fall under an expansion of the engine upgrade system, which is something I believe the devs would like to implement at some point, but having that many parts/variables all affecting the engine's operation and output would massively increase the time and effort spent on quality control during future updates. They'd simply have more complexity to deal with every time they wanted to add features or content.

    I'm not saying this won't happen, I'm saying if it does, it'll be closer to the full release when everything else is already in place and the game can be considered "mostly complete".
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  18. atv_123

    atv_123
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    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2012
    Messages:
    1,647
    I actually thought of something you guys might want to look into...

    While building the B1, being a heavy military vehicle and coming with some really underpowered engines like its real world counterpart, the Hummer H1, the work around to get everything up to speed is to have some really low gearing. The ratios in the transmission are low, the ratios for the low range gearbox is low, the ratios for the diffs are low, and the ratios in the geared hubs are low. Stacking all that on top of each other, you can start to end up getting some pretty nasty feedback from the driveline that can end up making the engine kinda wig out a bit.

    Even just a D Series with all the lowest range components and locked diffs can start to exhibit some of the behaviors. Basically, take some offroad vehicle that can get some SERIOUS gear reductions, put it in all the lowest ranges (First, Low Range, Crawler maybe?) and then point it down a hill. While with most gearbox setups you would get some feedback through the drivetrain which would increase the engine speed, we are dealing with gear reductions that are so low, that its almost impossible for any of the forces from the tires to even be perceived at the engine's side.

    Once you start to get this low though... Beam kinda doesn't really know what to do with the forces from the tires, so it tries to send feedback somewhere anyways. Sometimes it just bounces you back and forth in spot a few times, other times it gets confused and literally will rev the engine to the moon despite the fact that your barely moving (we are talking sub 5mph speeds here usually).

    Now, I know there is a difficulty here with the drivetrain feedback and force calculations for how stiff things can be when running at the frequencies you guys are... but I think this one deserves another look since we are now starting to get some official rock crawlers in the game, and can now really start to want to make use of these super low ratios.
     
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. class800

    class800
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    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2021
    Messages:
    9
    My issue to bring up is not 100% related to powertrain, but I imagine it is bundled up in a similar area of simulation.

    The 2-step launch logic needs a bit of a redo with more detail. Currently it doesn't work on automatic/dct gearboxes in any gear other than neutral. Also, sometimes it will fail to engage completely, or only engage once the rpm hits the limiter then drops back down to the 2-step hold. A list of individual things I would like to see improved regarding this:

    - If 2-step is enabled, then it should be possible to use it in "D" in an automatic or dct gearbox. This could be done by enable the use of a clutch on automatic and dct cars that are built for racing. Or, just remove the option of having 2-step on these cars altogether. Either way, it makes no sense currently.

    - Fix the 2-step not always engaging, or hitting the max rpm limiter then slowly falling to the 2-step rpm limiter.

    - Make a custom, more harsh noise (including more backfires depending on the exhaust) to simulate the effect that the 2-step method has on the fuel in the cylinders and exhaust.

    -Add a more advanced "launch control" which manages both rpm and clutch engagement both before and briefly after the launch for the more modern cars.


    My PC Spes:
    2060 Super, Ryzen 7 2700X, 32gb 3200mhz ddr4
    Input: Logitech dfgt, thrustmaster TH8A & T3PA
     
  20. CaptainZoll

    CaptainZoll
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    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,310
    I've had a similar experience attempting to make turbine engines, (in which i rev them up to ~30,000rpm, then put something like a 10:1 gear reduction in the transmission.)
    if the engine gets above a certain amount of revs/power, it seems like the frequency of changes in engine speed are already close to the limit of the physics, and combining that with the super low gear reduction causes a significant oscillation in the later part of the drivetrain, making the wheels wobble back and forth, even causing the engine to hold or increase in RPM with no throttle input.
    note also in the video that when I repeatedly switch from drive to neutral, the speed of both the wheels and engine drop quickly -could the wheels losing speed so rapidly be due to a sort of parasitic vibration, or is there something else going on here?

    (This may all just be due to something i'm doing wrong making it, but these issues don't seem present when coupled to a more normal-ratio gearbox)
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
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