Small Ibishu 4x4 Suv Creation 'the Sparrow'

Discussion in 'Ideas and Suggestions' started by Stiggy111, Aug 7, 2016.

  1. SixSixSevenSeven

    SixSixSevenSeven
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    Messages:
    6,968
    tight emissions regulations that were not applied to kei vehicles, a market sector in which 2 strokes dominated.

    Lack of torque? High rev power? What about motorcycle 4 strokes? What about detroit diesel 2 strokes? Torque and power, nothing to do with 2 versus 4 stroke but combustion chamber design, porting and stroke versus bore.

    Besides, you ever heard of a 730cc *DIESEL* engine putting out over 100 horsepower per litre (considered holy grail for petrol, let alone diesel which has lower horsepower per litre) while still meeting 50mpg urban and meeting european emissions requirements? 2 stroke magic.
     
  2. Googlefluff

    Googlefluff
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    250
    You're right, many cars of the time had four-strokes (I mentioned Honda in my last post as making two-strokes, but I was wrong), but to my knowledge there was never a small off-road car that had one. That's not to say it couldn't exist, but it didn't. The advantage comes with power. Forced induction wasn't really a thing yet in the passenger car market so turbo charging wasn't an option. You could get the same power out of a four-stoke, but that meant revving the bejezus out of it. This made the differences in reliability almost negligible between two- and four-stroke engines as they both had to be over-engineered for reliability anyway. To compare two contemporary engines (1972), Honda's four-stroke EA Twin-Carb engine produced 26Kw at 9,000rpm, whereas Subaru's EK34 produced 27Kw at only 6,500rpm. When you've got a four-stroke revving to 9,000, most advantages are evened out, which is why two-stokes were so common. When engines were allowed to be made larger, two strokes fell out of favour but for the time, they were just as good as their four-stroke counterparts. I'm not saying they were better, just that they were a different approach to the same problem.

    TL;DR The vehicle Gabe's making won't be a two-stroke, a pre-1976 kei 4x4 would.
     
  3. titleguy1

    titleguy1
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2015
    Messages:
    246
    Are we even s

    For the Kei car part, we are talking about the same era of cars, no? I'm talking about when the engine limitations were a maximum of 550cc, 1976 to 1990, I believe. Now, I may be quoting Wikipedia for this part, but that doesn't mean it's not trustworthy :p At this time stringent emission regulations were placed upon Kei cars, and many of the companies that built Kei cars prior to the new regulations face problems as, like you said, the market was dominated by 2-stroke engines- 2 stroke engines that produced an abundance of fuel emissions.

    4 stroke engines are high-revving because of their small size and don't need a lot of torque since they have a small load to pull. Detriot diesels are, well, diesels, which naturally produce more torque than horsepower. I may be mistaken saying that they produce less torque, but I'm sure that they have less power and torque low down and more near the peak power. Here's a graph to show what I mean.



    I never said anything about 2 strokes lacking power; in fact, it's just the opposite, as they can produce quite a bit more power than a conventional 4-stroke. 50 MPG is impressive for a 2-stroke, yes, but I'd say it's not that impressive for such a small engine assuming it's on the British fuel efficiency scale; a Honda CR-V with a 1.6L diesel gets 7 more MPG. 100 HP/Liter is quite good for a N/A petrol engine and very good for a diesel, although a few modern diesels easily eclipse that number (for example, the BMW 750d with 400 HP out of a 3.0L Turbodiesel Inline-6). Hell, the Honda I just mentioned has 160 HP from the 1.6, which is 100 HP/Liter last time I checked. The real question is how expensive the engine you mentioned is; I doubt that the production costs are feasible for a small car that inevitably it would and should be placed in.
     
    #103 titleguy1, Aug 17, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2016
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Googlefluff

    Googlefluff
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    250
    I think we might all be talking about different eras and vehicle types and confusing eachother.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    Thank you for this helpful information. That saved me a lot of time looking things up.
     
  6. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    So from what Gabe said about the underpinnings of the vehicle, I think that the possibility of a 2-stroke engine is really rather slim. It's most likely going to be a 4-stroke engine of some kind.
     
  7. SixSixSevenSeven

    SixSixSevenSeven
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    Messages:
    6,968
    of course, nothing like the wrangler ever got a 2 stroke. It's feasible in terms of technology, just wasn't ever done
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    Indeed.
     
  9. atv_123

    atv_123
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2012
    Messages:
    1,585
    That's the only reason that I liked the idea... if it was going to be Japanese then I thought it would be fun. I mean he is making up his own car manufacturers, so its not like it MUST be based in 100% fact. Silly engines, or transmissions, or suspensions, or whatever are all total possibility's because it is a game and there are technically no rules that govern what can and can't be done whether it happened it real life or not.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    Yes, I agree. Its entirely up to what Gabe wants to do.
     
  11. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    I just can't wait until we hit the viewing stage of the vehicle. I can't wait to see the concept Gabe has going.
     
  12. B727ClassicFlyer

    B727ClassicFlyer
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2013
    Messages:
    2,169
    Even though these are motorbikes, they both have 2-stroke and 4-stroke engines, which is what we're discussing that's going into this 4X4 SUV.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    Yes. Like I had said in a previous post, I do think that since the underpinnings of this future vehicle are that of a Wrangler, don't you think it's a little odd for a 2-stroke to be implemented?
     
  14. NismoR35

    NismoR35
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2013
    Messages:
    474
    He hasn't specified on which generation Wrangler he's doing. So it could mean anything from the YJ to the latest JK. Smallest engine you could get in the YJ was a 2.5L I4 from AMC, so technically a 2-stroke diesel or gas engine wouldn't be too far off, kind of. I would actually like to see if he'll implement both LHD and RHD versions, considering the Wrangler itself is of course sold rather globally. Even you could get a RHD in the US straight from the factory, although these were normally used by mail carriers in rural areas.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. geronimo9

    geronimo9
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2016
    Messages:
    184
    You said latest, but I doubt that. I could be wrong though.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Minionslayer23

    Minionslayer23
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2016
    Messages:
    6
  17. SixSixSevenSeven

    SixSixSevenSeven
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2013
    Messages:
    6,968
    Yeah but what about other vehicles we've had that would have been very global but we still only get LHD. They should really just start doing the dash handedness as a slot
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Stiggy111

    Stiggy111
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    572
    I agree with you here. Especially with something like a Jeep with a simple-ish interior that can be easily switched over from left to right.
     
  19. speednsnake

    speednsnake
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    Not to mention the fact that Jeeps were famously used as mail trucks here in the states, thus necessitating a RHD configuration.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Peterbilt

    Peterbilt
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Messages:
    234
    From 97 up to the present, you could get a TJ or a JK in right hand drive in the US from the factory for use on rural mail routes.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice